Lindsay’s take on the Tripoli Six has led to long-time commenter The Phantom quipping, “Maybe we can have as many comments on this as we’ve had on whether Judith Regan’s firing was justified or whatever other motherfucking bullshit is supposed to be important” (right now, the Regan thread is outcommenting the Tripoli Six one 28-7).
It seems that Libya’s main motivation is not necessarily covering up its hospitals’ sanitation problems, but extorting money from Bulgaria, which has a national dick size problem with paying.
The main problem is that it appears as if the Libyan people support the government here. Usually, the best way to undermine an authoritarian regime is to fund organizations that agitate for a peaceful democratic revolution, but such a revolution requires the regime to be deeply unpopular. The Phantom’s idea of punitive sanctions won’t delegitimize the regime enough, because it only emerged from ten years of sanctions in 2003. What works in Eastern Europe and will work in Iran won’t necessarily work in North Africa.
Abstract Nonsense 
Since one of the physicians is a Palestinian, Israel bashers like Mr. Lewy and Mr Packard should be demanding that the Palestinian Authority, such as it is, issue a demand that their countryman be freed. Where iare Abbas, Haniyah, et all when their constituant is being railroaded.
You don’t see me make a similar demand of Bulgaria. All I’m saying is that if Libya wants more money, then Bulgaria should give it; if Libya demanded money from Palestine, I’d say the same thing.
Re Levy
Mr. Levy is rather nieve concerning paying off blackmailers. There are three ways to handle a blackmailer.
1. Pay him off.
2. Arrange things so that one can blackmail the blackmailer.
3. Kill the son of a bi***.
Generally, the third is most effective.
I suggest that the US send a demand to the good Colonel that he free the 6 hostages or face an attack on Tripoli such as was perpetrated by President Reagan during his administration; I would not put the use of a nuclear weapon off the table here.
SLC–
Kill thousands of innocents in order to save 6 innocents? Why am I not surprised that you’ve suggested this?
Since those “innocents” are supporting their Governments’ actions, they are not innocents but collaborators and deserve no consideration.l
SLC,
I suppose the use of mini-nukes because of negative public reactions associated with nuclear war. Europeans should also stop their pathetic diplomatic efforts to negotiate the release of their innocent and illegally captured residents like Murat Kurnaz from Guantanamo.
Re Axel
Mr. Kumaz was not executed so comparing him with the 6 kidnapped doctors is comparing apples and oranges.
Since one of the physicians is a Palestinian, Israel bashers like Mr. Lewy and Mr Packard should be demanding that the Palestinian Authority, such as it is, issue a demand that their countryman be freed. Where iare Abbas, Haniyah, et all when their constituant is being railroaded.
Note to SLC: well-poisoning is generally not considered an effective debate tactic.
But anyway, since it appears we’re working with the neocon definition of “Israel basher” (n. anyone, gentile or Jew, who has failed to build a sufficiently large shrine to Bibi. synonyms: antisemite, holocaust denier), I’d guess that demanding such of the Palestinian authority is somehow a special requirement when the science blogosphere has been demanding a reaction from the entire civilized world, to no avail.
Since those “innocents” are supporting their Governments’ actions, they are not innocents but collaborators and deserve no consideration.
Good suggestion, but I’d be willing to bet that Euro-sissies might find the demand for massive collective punishment a bit objectionable given the whole thing is based on a condemnation of barbarism. But hey, what does everyone else know.
Re DiPietro
Since this is the first time I have heard from Mr. DiPietro, I feel it to be incumbent to correct some of his misguided impressions.
1. I do not, repeat do not, equate Israel bashing with anti-semitism, or holocaust denying. Clearly Mr. Levy is neither.
2. I am no admirer of Bibi who talks big but shrinks when the time for action is nigh. I will admit to a certain regard for Avigdor Lieberman, although it is not yet clear if he is just a more rough and ready version of Bibi. The real thing is Uzi Landau, who would never have operated as incompetently as Olmert the moron did in Lebanon last Summer.
3. I consider the application of the term Israel basher to an individual, such as Mr. Levy, to mean that that individual considers Israel to be responsible for most, if not all, of the failure to achieve an Israeli/Palestinian settlement. This idea is taken to even further extremes by individuals such as Mr. Baker who blame Israel for the problems of the US military in Iraq. This latter idea is, of course, complete bull**** as the fact of the matter is that Messrs Olmert, Abbas, Haniyah, and Maashal could sign a peace treaty tomorrow morning and it would have no affect whatever on the civil war between Sunni and Shiite Muslims in Iraq. The issues over which the latter groups are fighting have nothing to do with Palestine or Israel. As regards the issue of an Israeli/Palestinian settlement, Mr. Levy and Mr. Packard continually ignore the writings and speeches of Dennis Ross, no friend of the neocons, who devoted 10 years of his life to trying to achieve a Palestinian state and failed, due to the timidness of Yasir Arafat. Mr. Packard goes even further on his blog by denying the right of the State of Israel to exist as a Jewish state.
4. The same comment I made regarding the PA also applies to the EU who ought to be completely behind the Bulgarian Government in demanding the unconditional release of the Bulgarian nationals being held as acapegoats for the incompetence of the Libyian Government.
Okay, backing up…
This thread seemed to originally be based around two propositions:
1. Bloggers generally critical of Israel should make a special demand on the PA to demand the release of their constituent.
2. Collective punishment, including with nuclear weapons, is permissible if not entirely necessary.
It now seems to be based around:
1. Whether there has ever been an Israeli PM that SLC actually likes.
2. Whether non-Israeli’s should admire an overt racist, authoritarian and declared advocate of ethnic cleansing like Avigdor Lieberman and/or cheer on his and his parties ascent within Israel politics.
3. Whether the failure of Israel’s unilateral military actions can always be chalked up to the incompetence or unwillingness among Israeli PM’s.
4. Whether Israel is at all culpable in the failure to achieve a Palestinian settlement.
5. Whether Baker-Hamilton was correct to designate our role in the Israel/Palestine affair as a major liability and a source of strategic weakness in Iraq and the mid-east.
I’m lost.
Re DePietro
1. I liked Golda Mier, a tough lady indeed, like Margaret Thatcher.
2. As I said, it is not clear whether Lieberman is just a thuggish version of Bibi.
3. The answer is yes. Given the disparity in military capability between Israel and Hizbollah, even Dubya could have done better then Olmert the moron.
4. The answer is yes to a small extent. As the late Abba Eban once said, the Fakistinians have never missed an opportunity to miss an opportunity.
5. The answer is Baker doesn’t know his rear end from a hole in the ground. I can’t believe sombody as intelligent as Mr. DiPietro can believe that an Israeli/Palestinian settlement would have the slightest effect on the situation in Iraq. The hatred between the Sunnis and the Shiites has nothing to do with Israel as both hate Isreal only slightly less then they hate each other.